Is the Tea Party the new face of American bigotry?
Or are they only using bigotry as an issue while Obama is President?

"A Hitler mustache on a picture of our President Obama? Come on."

You must have encountered some miscellaneous fringe group. Genuine Tea Party types regard such embellishments as a compliment and would not call for impeaching the honoree.

While on Sunday, MSNBC wished, and the Mayor of NYC speculated, that the Time Square bomber was a Tea Party member-- and neither has retracted their lies, the Taliban threat in the USA is clear and present.

It turns out now that we have a very serious problem in this NY case and it is predicted to get much more serious.

The Wall Street Journal reports this evening that ?U.S. and Pakistani investigators are giving increased credence to possible links between accused Times Square bomb plotter Faisal Shahzad and the Pakistan Taliban.?Web Link

We got lucky in the Times Square matter, the threatened campaign of car bombings in American communities is very serious and very difficult to counter.

It took the IRA 40 years to get sophisticated with car bombs, it took the Iraqi insurgents 6 months-- it will take the Taliban days or weeks to plant lethal car bombs in the US towns, colleges, sports arenas etc---
these will not kill thousands at a time, but they will kill, maim and spread terror.

The NY Times Square car bomb was detected by a hot dog vendor-- not by billion dollar intelligence and surveillance technology.

Paul, you said that Stanford has a 'conservative bent"? Oh, come on!! On what planet are you living?? Hoover Tower from top to bottom maybe, but the rest of the campus has a reputation of being very left of Center, especially English, History, --the rest of the "Liberal Arts". Remember the Bruce Franklin days?

Where were you when Bushitler posters were all over? Where were you when the beyond reproach Stanfoo intellect, directed by Professor H. Bruce Franklin to burn down the NROTC building, did?
Take a tea beak, Bucky.

"Bucky" is a slur against African-Americans that is used by the Tea Party, especially in reference to President Obama. The term is a reference to the Buckwheat caricature from the 1930s.

'"Bucky" is a slur ....'

Reference please.

So although the tea party attracts all sorts, they are a void without any real centralized leadership. People threatened by them seem to attack them. One thing they seem to universally stand for is fiscal responsibility, a trait both major parties seem to lack.

"While on Sunday, MSNBC wished, and the Mayor of NYC speculated, that the Time Square bomber was a Tea Party member-- and neither has retracted their lies..."

I guess they thought the perp was another Tim McVey type.

"The NY Times Square car bomb was detected by a hot dog vendor-- not by billion dollar intelligence and surveillance technology."

All my liberal friends are telling me that. I don't know what DHS' box score is on cutting off terrorists, but I always wondered what (if anything) Bush was thinking when he created it. I mean, who ever solved a problem by throwing bureaucracy at it?

As idiotic, and unproductive as Hitler mustaches are we should be clear for those who knee-jerkingly finger point at ficticious coments and in the past events.

Hitler was a fascist, in the style of Mussolini. Fascism, that is corporatism, government run in an abusive, exploitative, warlike manner by a corporate plutocratic business elite far more parallel's what was happening under George W. Bush, and what is still happening in the US under the reign of corporate lobbyists and the co-opting of the government as slavish whipping boy for all societies faults that anything that is now happening under Obama.

The Nazis, called National Socialists, were not socialists anymore after Hitler seized control of the party and purged the real socialists from it introducing his nightmare version of fascism..

It is a logical, and political error to refer to Obama as a fascist, socialist and communist al rolled into one ... unless you just plain do not care about facts or having a discussion. If that's true, then it is hardly free speech.

President Bush on the other hand gave us a war of choice unrelated to terrorist aggression, tapped American's phones in violation of due process and existing law. There is some logical analogy for exaggerating the connection between Bush and the Nazis, which is not something I would do or ever did, or support. This kind of talk is unproductive, but since it ends up swamping all rational public discourse it is necessary to weigh in and confront it ... on both extremes.

The race card, the last refuge of a scoundrel. I would not presume to decide how the leaderless mob uses the language. When usage is ambiguous I infer from context. My uncle Bud called me Alfalfa and I ain't blond. A sad voiced comic whose name i can't recall held soliloquies to Bucky.

hitler's party was "NAZI'..please look up what it was, what he proposed, what he ran on, and what he did.

Socialism run amok turns into Communism which turns into Fascism..

Any dictator is facsism

however, he was, in fact, a 'socialist' promising everything to everyone ..

think about it.

back to the point.

"Tea party' has no 'leader'.. it is grass roots. it is against the unconstitutional ( a tired and worn phrase, to say the least, but still relevant) grab for power and money by our Federal govt for uncontitutional uses. Constitutional uses are to promote trade internally between states and between the USA and others, to defend our nation against invasion and/or attacks, to defend the liberty of individuals.

There is a part which specifically states that any jobs NOT enumerated for the Fed govt are RETAINED by the STATES.

Somewhere we have lost that foundation, and we 'tea partiers' want to return to it. We want our Fed govt to defend our nation ..our borders from invasion and from attack from outside. To defend inter-state commerce...where were they in the oil-spill that now threatens to shut down the coasts of many states? To defend individual liberties such as speech...where are they when citizens are being silenced because of depicting Mohammed or trying to speak about Mohammed in a CARTOON???

Our Fed has lost its way and thinks it is a local Community volunteer group. We need to go back to the goal of the Feds. Finish keeping the promises we made to folks above a certain age, and below that, reform our regulations so that below a certain age ( 50?/?) we know that we must invest in our OWN future retirment and our OWN future health care...

time to fix us..

me

Walter is at it again--using the term "bucky" to denigrate those that disagree with him. Too bad. He also considers two wrongs to make it a right--if people had posters making fun of Bush, then it is okay to do the same with Obama--strange way of thinking.
We also get to hear more stories from Walter about his past--relevance to this discussion is unknown.

Hey, Bucky, the reference to my past was in re:"Bucky" is a slur against African-Americans that is used by the Tea Party, especially in reference to President Obama. The term is a reference to the Buckwheat caricature from the 1930s"
I won't insult your intelligence by explaining the relevance.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but one wrong accepted makes a precedent. I have adequately explained my term "Bucky," If you chose to apply an alternate meaning unsupported by context, the poorer you are.
Caricatures have a long and unsanitary history in politics - a medium suitable for the unlettered does not belong in a literate society.

"If you chose to apply an alternate meaning unsupported by context, the poorer you are. "
There he goes again. Walter is on a roll. Those that disagree with him or his rantings are to be insulted.

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]

Sharon's posts have nothing to do with the topic being discussed in this thread.
Why is that?

Hey Sharon,

The poster just below your last entry and mine here is right--the topic is the Tea Party in Palo Alto, and the inappropriateness of vilifying this or any US President as a Hitler figure.

Perfectly fine to discuss the recent goings on in Times Square last weekend, and I suggest/request you start a thread to that effect, and confine your comments on this posting to the topic as I teed it up.

Thank you.

Paul Losch

If a leftwing group, at the same corner, had a picture of George W Bush with a Hitler mustache, they would be applauded by Palo Alto liberals.

The Tea Party groups have you on edge, Paul. You seem to have a bee in your bonnet about them.

Some folk get nervous when they see peasants greasing the tumbrels.

The Tea Party sees clearly a wave of change coming fast, but not the kind of change that President Obama imagined, is following right behind the financial tsunamis.
All of his ill-timed ?investments?,
like bloated Federal Health care,
immigration ?reform?,
and cap-and-trade have come at a time when they simply can?t be borne.
There?s simply not enough money to sustain them.
Institutions like featherbedded unions, monopolies and obsolete gatekeepers should view recent events in the same way that dinosaurs who looked up at an enormous descending meteor should.



The Tea Party understands the consequences of Obama taking the US down the European socialist garden path.

That is--
?The average EU country would need to have more than four times (434%) its current annual gross domestic product in the bank today, earning interest at the government?s borrowing rate, in order to fund current policies indefinitely.?

In other words, Europe would have to have the equivalent of roughly $60 trillion in the bank today to fund its very general welfare benefits in the future. Of course, it doesn?t.

Today, Greece is only the tip of a very large iceberg.
Portugal, Spain, Italy and Ireland together owe $3.9 trillion in short- and medium-term debts, an amount larger than their combined GDP, estimated last year at $3.3 trillion."Web Link

Whether or not the sudden fall in the Dow Jones today was exacerbated by a technical error or a hack should not obscure the main problem.
The world has been living beyond its means ?like a cut flower in a vase; fair to see yet doomed to die.?

Tea Party in Palo Alto point out that this is just as true of Palo Alto as it is of the US and Europe-- these economies are interconnected -- as we felt today-- the biggest drop in the market since 1987

"If a leftwing group, at the same corner, had a picture of George W Bush with a Hitler mustache, they would be applauded by Palo Alto liberals."

And their artwork would be saluted by Tea Partyers.

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]

Hi Jim,

I take umbrage against a display of any POTUS being portrayed with a Hitler mustache. I was no fan of W, and think he did some things that were beyond the pale, but I no more would support his getting portrayed that way than Obama or any President.

I cannot get my arms wrapped around the Tea Party. Clearly there are many angry people out there. I think the anger has been accumulating for some time, due to policy decisions made over many years, many administrations, both D and R, as well as a similar behavior of policy decisions at the state and local levels all over the country. Cluck, cluck, the chickens are coming home to roost.

It did not start on the day Obama became POTUS, although that seems when the Tea Party got galvanized.

Here are the 2 things that I find fault with the Tea Party movement:

1. What?s the connection between anger and action? ?I want my country back? is disingenuous. Huge disconnect between wanting to keep existing USG programs, such as Medicare, and opposing health care reform. Life support in order to keep GM (not Chrysler, they did not deserve it) going so it could get back on its feet. And it saved jobs for Tea Partiers. Just to cite a couple examples.

2. More disturbing to me is the people that appear to be the public faces that the Tea Party people are enamored of: Sarah Palin (vapid), Glenn Beck (broken record, no insight), and Rush (who as best as I can tell, still resides in this country, although he threatened to move to Costa Rica if Obamacare passed.) These are not serious people with a concrete point of view that could lead to another approach to our problems. They are pandering to a group of people who want to hear what they want to say.

I will hand it to Sarah Palin. She quickly figured out how to brand herself and make a ton of money.

There is a very long tradition of hurling mud at your opponents in American politics-- sad but it is was it is

Obama calls for civility-- but the WSJ points out today that he does nothing to promote this -- in fact he fosters itIf Mr. Obama is serious about his commitment to courtesy and respect, then he will need to demonstrate presidential leadership and rein in the verbal excesses of the leaders of his own party. He could start by having a conversation with Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who condemned those with different views on health care as being "un-American." He might also share a word with Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who recently accused Republicans of being "anti-American" and wanting to continue to "make love to Wall Street" by pressing for changes in a bill regulating the financial industry.
"If Mr. Obama is serious about his commitment to courtesy and respect, then he will need to demonstrate presidential leadership and rein in the verbal excesses of the leaders of his own party.
He could start by having a conversation with Speaker Nancy Pelosi, who condemned those with different views on health care as being "un-American."
He might also share a word with Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, who recently accused Republicans of being "anti-American" and wanting to continue to "make love to Wall Street" by pressing for changes in a bill regulating the financial industry."

"The race card, the last refuge of a scoundrel."

You know, being accused doesn't automatically make anybody innocent. Like, do you think cops shouldn't play the "burglar card" if they catch someone carrying stuff out of your house?

Paul, who was the judge who made reference to the value of circumstantial evidence by referring to trout in the milk pail?
As for being accused, I sign my name specifically to require that those accusing me know they are obliged by common decency to make a case other than their own accusation. Of course, common decency ain't too common sometimes.

The T- Party has turned out to be a major political force, get in front of it or get run over by it.

If the Eurozone goes into recession-- which is likely--it will depress our local economy dramatically and slow any recovery.

In terms of symbols-- W was like a Wilson and Obama is like a mini Mussolini, neither of them will go down in history as significant.

Their is an internet rule that once you invoke Hitler the debate is finished-- so Dems or Repubs are both foolish in using that image.

It is all about the Economy and it does not look good

Why are we Palo Altans, Californians, Americans so simple-minded that we are virtually paralyzed by having to treat everything equally?

EVERYTHING IS NOT EQUAL.

Portraying Obama as a Hitler figure is a very cold and calculated attempt to equalize him with George W. Bush, and Obama has not gotten the 6+ years of the honeymoon George Bush did, nor has he done any of the things that George Bush did to incite people to portray him as Hitler - yet.

This is the typical clever subliminal argument from the right, put average looking people who can be related to by "joe sixpack" and have them say something with that tweaks the right nerves for attention, then include some Anti-Obama offensiveness.

The left when they rudely portrayed Bush as a Nazi, and let's not forget Cheney, they had a point, they had a reason.

Bush was the most authoritative executive president there ever was - hense the Hitler-like associations with a grab for power.

Obama has over and over tried to get the system, the Congressional system to work ... he has been anything but authoritarian ... remember the health care bill that these folks call Obama Care ???? who wrote it ??? not Barack Hussein Obama ... it was nothing like the authoritarian backroom dealings of the last 8 years.

Things are not automatically equal, and those that make that kind of argument have a dishonest agenda.

Paul, Costa Rica would not want Rush Limbaugh as anything more than a money spending tourist.

Costa Rica is fairly socialist. Poor as they are they are almost totally energy self-sufficient, they have universal health care, and no army. Rush would be more at home in Panama, Guatemala, maybe Columbia ... where he could get his drugs more easily.

Oh, for a forum of issues. Approach any political argument with the sure knowledge that all politicians are scum, and it simplifies he process enormously.

"The T- Party has turned out to be a major political force, get in front of it or get run over by it."

Check out the news, Sharon:
Web Link
("Tea Party fails to brew up a storm in Republican primaries")

Web Link
("Tea party comes up short in early primaries")

The left is so desperate about the success of the Tea Party that they are trying to frame it as a reincarnation of the KKK and as a terrorist conspiracy--- good luck with that.
When Rep. Carson gathered reporters around him to spread the myth of racial slurs being hurled ?fifteen times? he painted the protesters not just as racists, but as a terrorist threat.
We know this, because Kerry Picket of the Washington Times recorded Rep. Carson as he explained it all to eager reporters.Web Link



You'll not find any proof that the tea party is about white rage because it simply isn't true.
Lets face it, the left is in a near panic over the tea party because they could only HOPE for the approval numbers of a group whose peaceful demonstrations would make Gandhi proud.

"The left is so desperate about the success of the Tea Party"

More news stories to discredit Sharon's claims:

Web Link
("In primaries, anger at D.C. doesn't translate
Incumbents, Washington-backed candidates perform well in N.C., Ind., Ohio")

"the myth of racial slurs"
the new MO of the tea party people and the republicans is to deny that anything ever happened. Basically they are saying that the distinguished congressmen are liars. Too bad Sharon is buying that story.

"You'll not find any proof that the tea party is about white rage because it simply isn't true. "
Maybe because the Tea Party membership is almost exclusively white. They rail and rant against the government and claim that america has "been taken from them"!!! It's about race.
Web Link

"Lets face it, the left is in a near panic over the tea party because they could only HOPE for the approval numbers of a group whose peaceful demonstrations would make Gandhi proud."
Clearly those approval numbers did not translate into any victories in the early primaries. But if the Tea Party is anti-current government, why isn't the right worried? or maybe the tea party is just an offshoot republican group bitter that an african-american is president.
As for making Ghandi proud:
Web Link

"The T- Party has turned out to be a major political force, get in front of it or get run over by it."

It seems that deja vu strikes again. That is precisely what good Germans were saying in 1932. I highly recommend reading Shirer.

"Godwin's law (also known as Godwin's Rule of Nazi Analogies or Godwin's law of Nazi Analogies) is a humorous observation made by Mike Godwin in 1990 which has become an Internet adage.
It states: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1.

Godwin's law is often cited in online discussions as a deterrent against the use of arguments in the widespread reductio ad Hitlerum form.........

....there is a tradition in many newsgroups and other Internet discussion forums that once such a comparison is made, the thread is finished and whoever mentioned the Nazis has automatically "lost" whatever debate was in progress.

Web Link

But, Sharon, the initial posting on this thread dealt with "hitler issues".

On the other hand, Hitler's armies are the only enemy we have fought that adhered to the Geneva Conventions.

Hitler's army adhered to the Geneva Convention?
I guess slave labor for US POWs is part of the convention?
Web Link
I always knew that you had a soft spot in your heart for of Adolph and his minions, I guess you were too young to fight for him in WWII.
Enjoy your trip to North Korea.

"Godwin's law ... states: "As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."

Godwin merely rephrases a well know phenomenon for his/her particular bee in the bonnet. As any universe evolves, the probability of occurrence for any event asymptotically approaches unity, unless that event is absolutely impossible.

Since your post so immediately followed mine, we can safely presume a cause-effect connection. I will therefore point out that I said nothing about Nazis or Hitler; I merely mentioned Germany in 1932, which was before the Nazis came into power. Why then were you so primed to leap to a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler?

Nevertheless, since the subject is on the table, can you explain why groups that behave like Brownshirts seem so touchy about being grouped with Brownshirts?

Tea partiers might actually have some interesting points to make. Too bad they bury them with racial slurs on the president and his wife.

If you've had enough of the Hitler analogy, how about the posters of Obama as a witch doctor or the one of the president and his wife as a pimp and a whore?

Whether these racist, anti-Semitic and just plain repulsive episodes are typical of the Tea Party or its extremists, they certainly don't make for any meaningful dialog. And if they are extremists, why doesn't the Tea Party disown them?

Tea Party Fundraising Email Shows Obama As Pimp
Web Link

McClatchy Reporter Responds to Right-Wing Attacks on Tea Party Story
Web Link

10 most offensive tea party signs
Web Link

Obama As Witch Doctor
Web Link

I consider myself quite sympathetic to the major issue championed by TEA partiers: fiscal responsibility.

I feel that the MSM and the liberal talking elites have tried throwing a lot of spurious stuff such as racism at them, but very little of it has stuck.

This November will show that many people in this country believe that their current congresspeople have acted irresponsibly by over-spending and grating unaffordable entitlements.

By the way, did you hear that McDonald's recently added the "OBAMA MEAL" to its menu? You can buy everything you want on the menu, and the guy behind you in line has to pay for it.

So I am assuming that Paul from Downtown North opposed the health care bill as he stated that nothing has ever been solved by adding bureaucracy. I agree with you, Paul. If not, you better rethink your DHS statement.

You may have been duped.

Before you decide that what you encountered was actually what you call Tea Partiers, please do something to verify they are not plants.

In several spots around the country left wingers are actively working to discredit the Tea Party by showing up with offensive signs and chants to make the real Tea Party look bad.Several Northeast US Democratic Party functionaries announced intentions to do so.And they did it in SF-see this link

Web Link

The real Tea Party folks do not behave the way you saw-they have every reason to know why not to even if they wanted to do that. Look at photos of the real rallies and you will see.

On the other hand, we have a very, very large supply of characters as far left as you want in our area. If you have seen them in action at any of the many demonstrations in SF you know they are capable of this and more.

Hot on the heels of the NAACP voting to condemn Tea Party as racist ( before they recanted and said they didn't really mean it) comes this

Web Link

Nice little racist rant at an NAACP meeting by a Fed Govt Employee who wielded power over others...judging them on color, not content. MLK continues to spin.

Looked up all the links above to supposed "racism" in the Tea Party. Couldn't find anything to them. The ONE that is racist has a very obvious papering over some word replaced with another one..and is shown only on the Huffington Post. Suspicious to me. Don't believe it.

Penultimately, nobody has ever come forward with a verifiable photo, e-mail, letter, poster, recording or videotape of anyone at any "Tea Party" saying or doing anything racist, in spite of an offer of $100,000 for such proof by Andrew Breitbart.

tick tock.

Lastly: I no more judge all blacks, or all Democrats, as "racist" for the comments of a few truly racist idiot followers and leaders in their midst, than I would judge the Tea Party movement racist even if someone DID turn up even one piece of evidence. The Tea Party movement has no leader, no elected politicians, no committee, no fundraising, no "nuttin'"..kind of hard to judge a movement based on the Constitution and grass roots as anything other than just that...a growing movement of fed up people who want our Feds to go back into their role, and leave us alone.

A Government with the power to take anything from any of its law abiding citizens, from money to property to speech, has the power to take it all. Give us back our freedom.