Town Square

Post a New Topic

President makes case for solar at MV's Walmart

Original post made on May 12, 2014

President Barack Obama spoke about energy efficiency at Mountain View's Walmart Friday morning, saying that if solar panels are good enough for cost-conscious Walmart, they are good enough for wide-spread use in the United States.

Read the full story here Web Link posted Saturday, May 10, 2014, 8:08 AM

Comments (17)

 +   Like this comment
Posted by Cur Mudgeon
a resident of Greenmeadow
on May 12, 2014 at 4:19 pm

At Wal-Mart? Really? What White House genius dreamed up this PR stop?
How about addressing the needs of the 99% Not a word said about minimum wage, decimation of the middle class, pollution by the imported plastic junk that is sold in such stores. The topic is important; I question the venue.
And yes, I do shop there--a refreshing change from Stanford Shopping Center to remind us not everyone is affluent.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Mrs. B
a resident of Menlo Park
on May 12, 2014 at 11:14 pm

"Climate change is real and we have to act now," said the president. "In Washington, we've got some climate deniers who shout loud, but they are wasting time (arguing) a settled debate."

This is a president who knows NOTHING WHATSOEVER about science. Nothing in science is "a settled debate." The more shrill and insistent the president and his unscientific cronies become about challenges to their "settled science", the more it becomes evident that there IS something to debate about the very notion of global warming - oops, it's now "climate change", since there is no evidence for a warming of the earth or atmosphere. The religious fervor with which the high priests of climate change scream for hugely disruptive changes to our economic system and energy sources is reminiscent of the fervor of the medieval Church in claiming the planets and the sun revolved around the earth. That was "settled debate" less than a millennium ago.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 13, 2014 at 9:28 am

"This is a president who knows NOTHING WHATSOEVER about science."

Probably correct (the absolutism, withstanding.) No president is elected on their science education, even the actors union president, St Ronnie.

Our American President is clearly smart enough, however, to realize that 90% of scientists consider Climate Change as settled science.

Alternatively, our American President can listen to self appointed experts link "Mrs. B" of Menlo Park, who insists: "...there is no evidence for a warming of the earth or atmosphere"

Ahem.

Fact: "Including 2013, 9 of the 10 warmest years in the 134-year period of record have occurred in the 21st century. Only one year during the 20th century—1998—was warmer than 2013."

Web Link

What a science galoot, that "Mrs. B" of Menlo Park!

Turn off the fox!

"Mrs. B" of Menlo Park or another fox viewer will now reply, changing the goalposts or otherwise deflecting her absurdly wrong statement. In three, two, one...




 +   Like this comment
Posted by Chris Zaharias
a resident of Crescent Park
on May 13, 2014 at 10:21 am

Chris Zaharias is a registered user.

D Barwaithe, here I am, on time. As an independent thinker with three children of my own, I can't tell you how tiresome it's been over the years to see good people with good intentions be lulled by their own false righteousness into falling for the scam that is anthropogenic global warming. Not that many in Palo Alto are open to a middle ground reality check, but please read on if you are:

1) IPCC science. If you read about the IPCC, you quickly realize their reports are anything but the settled scientific fact you appear to think they are. Exhibit One: Web Link

2) CO2 cause & effect - whereas none of the information linked to above gets anywhere near proving that CO2 has caused warming and not the inverse, hundreds of millions of years of pre-human data exists to prove that both warming and cooling occur when CO2 is as much as 10X higher than it is today. "Perhaps the simplest way to expose the fallacy of 'extreme certainty' is to look at the historical record. When modern life evolved over 500 million years ago, CO2 was more than 10 times higher than today, yet life flourished at this time. Then an ice age occurred 450 million years ago when CO2 was 10 times higher than today.

"The fact that we had both higher temperatures and an ice age at a time when CO2 emissions were 10 times higher than they are today fundamentally contradicts the certainty that human-caused CO2 emissions are the main cause of global warming." From Patrick Moore's recent U.S. Senate testimony: Web Link

3) IPCC of warming alarmist models have been consistently wrong. Have you bothered to explain to your children that the only thing consistent about the math models upon which CO2-based global warming fears are based is that they've always ended up being wrong? WSJ: Web Link

I could go on and on with legitimate, scientific destruction of AGW, but more importantly, I hope everyone can move on from this tired dialectic and focus on the one thing all sound minds should agree on, which is that national and local energy independence, natural resource preservation and durable quality of life are the true, sound bases for emissions reduction advocacy. On *that* point, I'll refer back to what another PAOnline commenter on another thread said:

"Whether or not you can handle the science behind Global Warming, it has got to be a good thing to think about our impact on the environment and to move toward energy alternatives that reduce carbon emissions. It just makes sense. Our responsible decisions role model good stewardship for our community's children and create in all of us more mindful attitudes toward our choices and how our actions impact our world. Remember if we want youth to buy into our values, we must demonstrate values worth caring about."

That sounds great, but PA residents drive big, fat cars, have big, fat homes, take big fat vacations, eat huge amounts of food and as such, IMHO, talking about energy decisions outside of the geo-political reasons for energy independence shows us to by hypocrites more than anything else. I think we do our kids a disservice when we let our righteousness lead us astray.

Last - Obama's WH solar array powers about 1-2% of WH energy consumption. It's a political gimmick, nothing more.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 13, 2014 at 11:08 am

Chris: "As an independent thinker with three children of my own, I can't tell you..."

Shucks, I wish I was an independent thinker also! Then I too could start a post that doesn't address the above comments, and yet still pat myself on my back! I could deviate to a comment from another thread as a straw man, talk about the inadequacy of limited solar panels on one of the busiest buildings in our country and so much more! I could post a link to an op/ed from a couple deniers and claim it as fact! Wow! Now I'm an independent thinker!

Unfortunately, I have only two children, so clearly you are superior in every way.

Now, one could follow your deviations, straw men and other absurdities (offspring as validation?!?) and disprove, or the the least, cast doubt on their sources, but let's start by staying within the frame of the comment from "Mrs. B":

- Mrs. B: "...there is no evidence for a warming of the earth or atmosphere"

- Fact: "Including 2013, 9 of the 10 warmest years in the 134-year period of record have occurred in the 21st century. Only one year during the 20th century—1998—was warmer than 2013." source: NOAA

Do you agree with her statement?

Your 500+ words were remarkably entertaining, but again, let's start with the basics: do you agree with Mrs. B?

If so, how is that statement believable to you in the face of the facts from NOAA?

Lastly, how is this statement indicative of "false righteousness"? Please explain how those facts from NOAA are "false righteousness".


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Just the Facts
a resident of Charleston Meadows
on May 14, 2014 at 10:01 am

WalMart can easily afford to install solar because they grievously underpay their employees in the name of a large profit margin.

After Sam Walton died, his heirs stopped offering health benefits to their employees--so then WalMart had a high number of employees who had a less than rudimentary knowledge of the English language. A lot of people ( including our entire family and many of our friends) boycotted WalMartt that time. Some still do, because of the low pay the employees must suffer.

WalMart is not a good example of anything, other than selling cheesy and inferior China-produced products and clothing.

But our president did not bother to check out any of these facts, did he? Otherwise he would not have made his embarrassingly ignorant speech there!


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 14, 2014 at 10:50 am

"But our president did not bother to check out any of these facts, did he?"

You used a question mark at the end of your declaration, so I will treat it as a question.

You're a fool if you think that isn't common knowledge and/or leftist opinion. My guess is it was a choice: to reward a solid step in the correct direction, or not to do so.

I'm no fan of Walmart. Remember when Sam Walton was proud of many items being made in America?

Just curious: what was "embarrassingly ignorant" in the speech? Please feel free to identify the particular phrases, in context.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by pa
a resident of Community Center
on May 14, 2014 at 11:15 am

Promoting Solar Panels in a Walmart? Well Done!.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 14, 2014 at 12:13 pm

"Promoting Solar Panels in a Walmart? Well Done!. "

Uh, yes, in fact it is. Using the power of the pulpit to make sure that other CEO's realize the issue.

The issue? Green pays. GREEN PAYS A BILLION DOLLARS.

"...the company will save $1 BILLION A YEAR on energy costs by 2020 by adding 7 billion kWh of solar to its 850 million square feet of buildings in the U.S., a space equal to half the city of San Francisco..."

As much as we know that Walmart does a lot of bad things for the economy, their green efforts are a good thing.

In fact - they are: "Well Done!."


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Alice Schaffer Smith
a resident of Green Acres
on May 14, 2014 at 10:37 pm

Alice Schaffer Smith is a registered user.

Green may pay, but Walmart underpays their employees, putting them at the poverty level and needing food stamps to feed their families.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 16, 2014 at 11:41 am

Chris: "As an independent thinker with three children of my own, I can't tell you..."

To follow up to the reply you have yet to respond: last month was the second-warmest April worldwide since scientists began recording temperature data, according to NASA. Web Link

Last month was just a bit lower than than the warmest April ever recorded, in 2010.

This April becomes the 350th month in a row where Earth has experienced above-average temperatures, in what most scientists agree is largely caused by increases of man-made greenhouse gases emitted into the atmosphere. Related: April 2014 also marked the first month in human history when average carbon dioxide levels reached above 400 parts per million.

So, Chris, let's go back to the question asked: do you agree with "Mrs. B" when she says "...there is no evidence for a warming of the earth or atmosphere"


 +   Like this comment
Posted by D Barwaithe
a resident of Esther Clark Park
on May 17, 2014 at 4:49 pm

Yo Chris, here's another radical hippy group that believes in Climate Change:

Center for Naval Analyses Military Advisory Board Web Link

"The accelerating rate of climate change poses a severe risk to national security and acts as a catalyst for global political conflict, a report published Tuesday by a leading government-funded military research organization concluded.

The CNA Corporation Military Advisory Board found that climate change-induced drought in the Middle East and Africa is leading to conflicts over food and water and escalating longstanding regional and ethnic tensions into violent clashes. The report also found that rising sea levels are putting people and food supplies in vulnerable coastal regions like eastern India, Bangladesh and the Mekong Delta in Vietnam at risk and could lead to a new wave of refugees.

In addition, the report predicted that an increase in catastrophic weather events around the world will create more demand for American troops, even as flooding and extreme weather events at home could damage naval ports and military bases."

Web Link

Web Link

So, Chris, let's go back to the question asked: do you agree with "Mrs. B" when she says "...there is no evidence for a warming of the earth or atmosphere" ???


 +   Like this comment
Posted by daddy
a resident of Barron Park
on May 19, 2014 at 1:15 pm

Hey... I have 6 kids. That makes my opinion twice as good aa zaharias


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Chris Zaharias
a resident of Crescent Park
on Jun 23, 2014 at 6:16 am

Chris Zaharias is a registered user.

Web Link

That tens of millions of Americans & Europeans continue to believe in climate change is no less surprising than our continued belief in superstition (knock on wood, don't jinx yourself, etc).


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Do the Math
a resident of Mountain View
on Jun 23, 2014 at 12:33 pm

It actually takes AT LEAST 20 years for the cost of the solar installation to pay itself off. In residential homes not originally built for it, it can cause roof damage ( happened to our first house, which had solar panels: panels had to be removed and roof compleat sly replaced due to mold and rot caused by heat and moisture collection between the panels and the roof itself) .

To complicate things, PG and E and other providers nationwide are trying to get out of being forced to buy power produced by homeowners but not used.

Wait until all the bugs are worked out of this before investing in it.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by curmudgeon
a resident of Downtown North
on Jun 23, 2014 at 4:07 pm

"tens of millions of Americans & Europeans continue to believe in climate change is no less surprising than our continued belief in superstition..."

What's "believe in" got to do with anything? The world has a perverse way of doing what it wants, ignoring what people believe or don't believe.

Caution: if one fine day you decide not to "believe in" the Pacific Ocean, don't do that road trip to Hawaii you always wanted.


 +   Like this comment
Posted by Rupert of henzau
a resident of Midtown
on Jun 23, 2014 at 5:43 pm

One should look into the background of the writer of the article that Zaharias cites.
Web Link

He also believes that secnd hand smoke and asbestos are not problems. And he believes in intelligent design!
Any other article you want us to read, zaharis?


Don't miss out on the discussion!
Sign up to be notified of new comments on this topic.

Email:


Post a comment

Posting an item on Town Square is simple and requires no registration. Just complete this form and hit "submit" and your topic will appear online. Please be respectful and truthful in your postings so Town Square will continue to be a thoughtful gathering place for sharing community information and opinion. All postings are subject to our TERMS OF USE, and may be deleted if deemed inappropriate by our staff.

We prefer that you use your real name, but you may use any "member" name you wish.

Name: *

Select your neighborhood or school community: * Not sure?

Comment: *

Verification code: *
Enter the verification code exactly as shown, using capital and lowercase letters, in the multi-colored box.

*Required Fields

Sneak peek: Bradley's Fine Diner in Menlo Park
By Elena Kadvany | 5 comments | 3,470 views

Marriage Underachievers
By Chandrama Anderson | 0 comments | 1,698 views

Politics: Empty appeals to "innovation"
By Douglas Moran | 13 comments | 1,626 views

Best High Dives to Watch the Game
By Laura Stec | 5 comments | 1,378 views

It's Dog-O-Ween this Saturday!
By Cathy Kirkman | 2 comments | 884 views