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New Housing Bubble in Palo Alto blown by Chinese money

Original post made by Calder on Feb 1, 2013

Housing prices are going through the roof again. Although people say that Palo Alto prices never go down that is not true. Prices did fall after 2008 and are only now growing higher again. So what is of concern is that over 60 percent of houses in Palo Alto are being sold to mainland Chinese. Now if these people want to stay and invest in our community, to put their kids through school and university, then that will be fine. However many are unable to do so and can only buy in on visas that restrict their stay to the length of their investment in companies. The source of their income remains in Chinese industry or government. If China runs into a period of slowdown then these people may need to repatriate their money and the current housing boom here could fall back 30 percent to 2009 prices. Just sayin.

Comments (50)

Posted by Immigrant, a resident of Charleston Gardens
on Feb 2, 2013 at 10:34 am

I understand that there is investment by many Chinese in other parts of Palo Alto, but in my neighborhood in south-east Palo Alto most of the houses are being bought by GOOGLE employees and most of them are either east Indian and/or Pakistani immigrants.

I understand the schools in south Palo Alto are now filling up with east Indian and/or Pakistani immigrant children. Why all this concentration on Chinese buying up Palo Alto? Palo Alto is a multi-national community of immigrants from many countries, my own included, I was born in England, and so were some of my neighbors.

If realtors want to sell houses here they must realize that Chinese immigrants are only a part of the multi-national equation in PA.


Posted by Chinese born in America, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 2, 2013 at 12:42 pm

Immigrant,

The Asian culture values education and saving money. Therefore, they seek out the best public schools. Saratoga and Fremont, Cupertino, formerly WASP towns, have been taken over by Asians. The UCs are being taken over by Chinese (UCLA = University of Caucasians Living Among Asians, UC Irvine= University of College Immigrants). South Palo Alto is being taken over by Asians because of the lower cost of houses and the Gunn reputation.Silicon Valley attract Asian immmigrants because math is a desired subject of Asians.

The North Palo Alto Asians seem to be more assimilated than the South Palo Alto Asians. They have a better grasp of English and follow more of the American culture.

The realtors are going to sell to the highest bidder rather than care about diversity of the town.

We must learn to keep open our hearts to all immigrants, otherwise move elsewhere outside of Silicon Valley.


Posted by Citizen, a resident of College Terrace
on Feb 2, 2013 at 1:19 pm

Here is a real concern: if an immigrant ( I was one once) buys real estate in this country, that parcel of land becomes a colony of the immigrant ' s country.

Think about it.


Posted by American culture, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 2, 2013 at 4:06 pm

The American culture values education, too.
Just an fyi.


Posted by Ha, no way!, a resident of Stanford
on Feb 2, 2013 at 5:34 pm

@American culture: No, American culture does not value education as much as Asian culture. Look the poor salary of teachers in our country and the work ethic of students (not in PAUSD, in other parts of the country). If an Asian doesn't earn at least "B"s in school, he is a failure. And Asians are forced by their families to attend college.


Posted by Citizen, a resident of College Terrace
on Feb 2, 2013 at 6:26 pm

No, Americans do not abuse their children for getting bad grades. I have known Japanese and Chinese families who have kicked their children out of the house for a month because of a B on a math test. The family of one of my Son's friends took one of these kids, a girl, in. Years ago, I had a Chinese student whose parents disowned her for getting into Davis, and cut her off financially. She did not know what to do, and married the first boy who asked. The rest is a disaster story.

But, yes, this country pays teachers very poorly. My husband's cousin teaches English at Tokyo University. He is paid so well that he owns three homes there, and one here. HOWEVER, he was told by the school, that the kids who show up for class are to get As. The ones who do not, are to get Bs!

Most of the world gives teachers great respect and pay. In the former Soviet Union, I have been told by former Soviet teachers, only doctors were better paid.

The biggest problem here is that the Chinese come here with millions of dollars in pocket, and can afford good schools and good neighborhoods. The average American does not get paid well enough to do that.....which is why we continue to buy cheap, crappy Chinese goods. You will notice that Americans with money DO NOT by cheap Chinese junk because they can afford NOT TO!


Posted by Resident, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 2, 2013 at 7:40 pm

If America valued education the children would be in school more than 280 days a year and more hours per day. There would be no scholarships or special treatment for athletes and no affirmative action either.


Posted by Resident, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 2, 2013 at 7:41 pm

correction 180 days a year


Posted by Chinese Born in America, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 3, 2013 at 12:41 am

Citizen: Your stories must be rare because I have never heard of such stories. You shouldn't spread such stories like they are common. First off, how many Japanese live in Palo Alto? I have 4 children and only know of one half-Japanese child. There are virtually no Japanese in Palo Alto. Secondly, there are only 4-6 "A"s per class, so not every Asian is earning "A"s.

I do agree we'd have higher quality teachers if they earned 6 figures (talking nationwide, not PAUSD). There are many who would enjoy teaching if it paid more. Money talks.


Posted by American culture, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 3, 2013 at 9:58 am


@Ha No way!
The small, elite, educated, wealthy slice of Asians you witness living here is hardly representative of these various large-population countries.
Typical Palo Alto centered thinking - like THIS is the center of the universe. It's a big world out there.


Posted by jerome, a resident of Professorville
on Feb 3, 2013 at 3:08 pm

They are not "Asian." That is a very broad category. Its mainly mainland Chinese who are still nationals of the Communist plutocracy of mainland China. They are not the cultural elite that you find at Stanford. They are the Chinese who made money running factories in China.

I am tired of everyone running down the US education system. Californa is an education superstar. The best school districts like Palo Alto routinely get kids into the Ivies. THe UCs are some of the best universities on earth.

Why do you think the Chinese are buying Palo Alto if our education system is not fantastic? Its because our schools and universities are fantstic and an international bargain all for the price of a block of land, with money made in China by running factories and paying nothing to the workers.

But I agree. It is really weird when you have great American teachers teaching to a class room that is 3/4s mainland Chinese. Its a weird period of time which seems to give all the advantages to teh mainland Chinese and none to teh Americans who are being crowded out of the UC system. Its not fair to American kids who are just as smart as the mainland Chinese but who do not work as hard to be deprived of a UC education.


Posted by Patriot, a resident of Old Palo Alto
on Feb 3, 2013 at 3:40 pm

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


Posted by Mama, a resident of Community Center
on Feb 4, 2013 at 10:11 am

One of my daughter's closest friends is Chinese-American. She and her mother tell us that they are embarrassed by the actions and behaviors and Superstitions of most Chinese nationals. They feel that the mainland Chinese reflect badly on them, and they are mortified to often be mistaken for someone from China. So they try very hard to be very American: dress more Californian, keep houses in good repair, never speak mandarin or Cantonese in public, never cut in line, be polite, encourage children to have friends outside the home.
E



Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 4, 2013 at 10:54 am

"No, American culture does not value education as much as Asian culture."

I never hear of rich Americans traveling overseas to spend a year at the U of PekingBeijing, Taiwan State or Bombay PolyTech.

A year in Italy, France? Yes.

Now then, how many Asians travel to attend American schools?


Posted by Terry, a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis
on Feb 4, 2013 at 10:55 am

I have also heard it from a local Asian family that they don't think much of the abrupt, pushy behavior of newly arrived Chinese nationals. Unfortunately its these people who have all the money the US paid them for stuff outsourced to US factories. And in return they are buying up the best places in California.


Posted by Be nice, a resident of Palo Alto High School
on Feb 4, 2013 at 1:40 pm

All the same, until they become citizens, they are guests in this country. If they cannot act like nice guests, then they have overstayed their welcome and should go home.

Yet they whine and complain about the downfalls of living here, but then they refuse to leave. Are they just complainers by culture??


Posted by Chinese Born in America, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 4, 2013 at 2:06 pm

I completely agree with "Mama" and am also embarassed when I am around Chinese who don't try to assimilate and exhibit rude behavior such as bumping into me and not acknowledging it. To me, it's crystal clearn but unfortunately, not all Caucasians can see the difference between Americanized Chinese and immigrant Chinese. They also don't realize that there are also Koreans, Taiwanese, Vietnamese, Japanese, and their is a hierarchy. There has been a huge influx of Koreans and they are different than Chinese.


Posted by Boy what a Ducati, a resident of Old Palo Alto
on Feb 4, 2013 at 5:45 pm

It is pretty clear that a certain poster(s) have issues with the Chinese and they are using this forum to denigrate an entire race of people based on that dislike. Their evidence is something they heard from a daughter of a Chinese American/a local Asian family/ a neighbor etc ( you get the picture) .
It is clear what their real purpose is and I find their comments disgusting.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 4, 2013 at 5:56 pm

They should be banned from Baume, dogs and all!


Posted by rob, a resident of Woodside
on Feb 4, 2013 at 6:42 pm

Glad I experienced Palo Alto in it's transition from hippy college town to silicon valley center. Things sound scary now.


Posted by Smells like, a resident of Barron Park
on Feb 5, 2013 at 11:15 am

Sounds like there are some people who are lucky enough to be in neighborhoods as yet ungraced by uncouth mainland Chinese buyers. Please, honor us and reveal what neighborhoods those are, so that some of us can move there.


Posted by Smells like, a resident of Barron Park
on Feb 5, 2013 at 11:17 am

Oh, and while you're at it, please recommend an honest real estate agent or two.


Posted by Chinese Born in America, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 5, 2013 at 11:55 am

@smells like: North PA has more assimilated Chinese immigrants.


Posted by C, a resident of Palo Alto High School
on Feb 5, 2013 at 6:58 pm

My personal opinion is that Google employees are making purchasing a house, or even renting an apartment, absurdly expensive. If you look up Google's shuttle stops, you'll note that housing nearby is significantly more expensive than areas without Google-stops. And, of course, Palo Alto schools also skyrocket the value of houses.

As for the "they're not going to stay here long" idea, I don't think that's really true. Most people stay here; I don't see many families moving away, and, even when they do, their places are immediately taken. I don't understand the big deal.

About Asians traveling to the US -- assuming you mean that our education system must be superior because they are coming here, that just reinforces the point that immigrants who come here for education care more than Americans about education. How many Americans do you see moving to Singapore, New Zealand, or elsewhere for a better education? Just saying.


Posted by TK, a resident of Leland Manor/Garland Drive
on Feb 5, 2013 at 7:30 pm

The Chinese stopped buying in Vancouver. No one knows why. Pretty well bought it out, now stopped coming. The same could happen here. Pretty smart if you ask me. Forget about the spitting, flip flops and plastic bags. They are pretty smart. If prices get too high here they will move on to the next town where prices still low enough. Could be that is happening right now.


Posted by palo alto mom, a resident of Embarcadero Oaks/Leland
on Feb 6, 2013 at 2:21 pm

First of all, if you can afford to buy a house in Palo Alto, go for it. Many of the people who move here for a short time (to send their kids to Gunn for example) rent not buy.

TK - Palo Alto real estate is still going strong, two houses recently sold on Seale, one for more than 5 million and one for 6.


Posted by Anon., a resident of Crescent Park
on Feb 8, 2013 at 2:16 am

I hope this post is not edited or deleted. I'm not sure there is a better way I could explain what it is I am trying to get at, and I don't mean to express any cultural bias, quite the opposite.

There is worldwide pattern of behavior of rich Chinese. It has been to expand into other countries in enclaves and support their own while criticizing and not-melting into the local community and country. It has created resentment and chaos in many countries, and with the current problems in the US with the disparity in income it is not going away here either. I have heard from close Asian and Chinese friends of Chinese calling America decadent and Americans inferior and not to be mixed with, except to sell stuff in stores to. I was reminded of guess whose coming to dinner and the huge effort America went to to teach an agenda or tolerance and equal rights. Will the modern world overcome and swamp such outdated notions, or are we as a world not as advanced as we think we are?

Having come from and seen some backward parts of the US I appreciate most foreign people and appreciate the diversity they bring here to this country, but when it happens in huge uncontrolled movements we risk losing our own country. When groups are tempted due to lack of visibility of lack of any pushback to become a good-old-boy network of their own, how do we expect people to resist when our own values these days are just about getting money and power at all costs, even cheating?

I have to say I have seen coalition of foreign people working together to promote each other at companies and in business and it vexes me. Mangers slowly working their way up and then treating their own preferentially. If this is a thing that they majority of Americans have been ideally trying to advance past and work for something new and ideal, why is this kind of behavior on the part of others acceptable?

There is no way a white American male even has legal or moral standing to make a comment about this because it is deemed ugly and racist ... often rightfully so, but does that mean that overlooking other groups that do the same thing is something proper?

These issues are clearly too deep for my shallow brain, but when we allowed the country to be all about money the top 1% opened the door to this as they are about to do again with "immigration reform", MADE THE BEDS FOR ALL OF US, and now WE ALL HAVE TO SLEEP IN IT. It's a problem that cannot be talked about or dealt with p the absolute worst kind. It was predicted by Marx & Engels surprisingly enough that unregulated capitalism will cause its own death in ways like this so we ought to start paying attention.

While we "Liberals" in America are busy strolling along with our heads in the air dreaming about a new society that is fair and just our country is being bought out from underneath us with money that really has no grounding in our economy, it's just bribery to those at the top to undercut everyone else's rights - just as we do with local people all over the world. Doesn't feel so good when we are victims though.


Posted by shortmemoryagain, a resident of Community Center
on Feb 8, 2013 at 8:40 am

Just a year or 2 ago, no one want to buy a house because it was a bad investment. Bank don't want to lend, and owners want to get out at any cost. I remember people couldn't get a loan, this was a real USA problem!
Now with the foreign money showing up on real estate and the sinking ship finally got lift, people(renters?) are talking about liberty. The bottom line is "Can't you get a loan?" This is a real problem beyond Palo Alto my friend.


Posted by Chinese-American, a resident of Another Palo Alto neighborhood
on Feb 8, 2013 at 9:32 am

Re "anon"s statement: "I have seen coalition of foreign people working together to promote each other at companies and in business". Cultures tend to feel most comfortable with themselves. Caucasians do the same thing, and it's called the Old Boys Club!

I have endured racism in the Caucasian midwest - glass ceilings, Caucasian buddies being promoted when they aren't they most qualified, friends who are members of a golf & country club not speaking with us in the club environment, "religious" Caucasians speaking poorly of other cultures.

The bottom line is, those who cannot compete have to move elsewhere in America, perhaps midwest, rural America, where life is simpler and cheaper.


Posted by Reader, a resident of Palo Verde
on Feb 8, 2013 at 10:05 am

What is even more disturbing to me is the way that Muslims move into an area en masse, making it uncomfortable for non-Muslims to live there. They then take on school leadership as well as city council roles and eventually cause the council to be unbalanced in their favor due to voters favoring those of the same religion. They then change local laws to suit themselves and their culture. This has happened a great deal in Britian, so much so that even the police have to be Muslim to be physically safe from the locals in some areas.

This can happen here if we are not watching for it.


Posted by Anon., a resident of Crescent Park
on Feb 8, 2013 at 10:28 am

Chinese-American, thank you for responding to my post. Having lived in the South for a brief spell on a job, I well know about Caucasian racism, and certainly do not condone it. There is a reason I am happily back in California after being in what was like a foreign country. But, with all the goodwill of many there are laws and attitudes that are changing, have changed. On paper there is nothing like it outside of Western economic culture ... that I know of.

Are there anti-discrimination laws in China that support Tibetans for example, or other ethnic minorities in China? What are the underlying attitudes of Chinese on this issue. Psychologically, the China has been down for so long in the world is there an imperialistic backlash here? From the glimpses I've gotten into some of these ideals, usually through my friends talking about their parents, it's there, just as the Old Boys Club still is.

I've heard similar things from Mexicans actually. Many have actually said, in jest I hope, that they were taking back California, and in other parts of the world Muslims work a similar process even seeking to bring Islam and their own version of legal precedent to people who do not welcome it. Is this "crap" what is on all our minds at some subconscious level, and if so does anyone care or want to change it?

What I am asking is that if the Old Boys Club in America finally gets overturned, are we going to get just another non-White Old Boys Club to replace it, and if so, what is the point? The world cannot tolerate more war, be in military or population, there are already too many people, yet from certain attitudes, say for example the continuation of serving shark fin soup in restaurants that newer values such as environmentalism are ignored and perhaps mocked with the priority being selfish as opposed to doing the right, on all sides by the way, all groups do this to some extent.

Your bottom line says a lot ... the Old Boys Club way to "compete" is not really competing is it - that is the problem, yet you turn it around, while expressing no interest in discussing or solving the larger problem in general, only in validating what is the same old problem in reverse, unless I have misinterpreted you. Will that attitude fade as Chinese succeed and prosper? Thanks for your thoughts.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 10:48 am

"They then change local laws to suit themselves and their culture. This has happened a great deal in Britian,"

what the ?????

Keep it real, as in... GET REAL.


Posted by Anon., a resident of Crescent Park
on Feb 8, 2013 at 11:05 am

Values, a resident of the Fairmeadow neighborhood ... the comment that you responded to, as pointed as it was, is essentially true. Here is a link to the website One Law For All, a group against the imposition of Islamic law and ways of life in Britain.

Web Link

Take a look at it, it's very interesting in documenting the problem. Also videos on You-Tube by the atheist critic Pat Condell are very informative on this subject. I'm not sure what your "criticism" of Reader's statement was, since you did not make one, can you elaborate?


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 11:18 am

Thats a tangled website... I particularly admire all the noise leading up to this petition: Web Link

Sure sounds like a bunch of redneck voodoo like we saw with Oklahoma and their law banning "Sharia" law.

Let's make it simple: list any 5 or 10 laws enacted in Britain that are based on Sharia law.

Lawdy, Ms Clawdy, we know that no one in 'Murica would try to pass laws based on the Bible or anything.

Why y'all have so little faith in the Constitution amazes me...

If you don't like Chinese money buying up real estate (like Japanese money in the 80's, and Arab money all along,) don't buy crap made in China. Or Arab oil, etc..


Posted by Anon., a resident of Crescent Park
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:17 pm

Hi values ... I only mean that reasonable people can disagree on this and I don't intend to argue either side of the issue here with you. But one thing I would say that is that personally I am not a "faith-based" person and whatever faith I have in whatever (Constitution,Bible,Koran,etc) is not a basis of gambling my life and the survival and prosperity of my family and country on - ever. The facts of these issues are clouded and difficult to navigate, so discussing it as clearly and objectively as possible seems like a good idea to me.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:29 pm

"The facts of these issues are clouded and difficult to navigate, so discussing it as clearly and objectively as possible seems like a good idea to me."

Really? So show me ("clearly and objectively") the top ten Sharia laws implemented in Britain.

Maybe the issues are "clouded" alright. Like the freakazoids in Oklahoma screaming about non-existent Sharia law. Somethings clouded, but it ain't THE FACTS.

So yeah, I completely disagree with the statement "The facts of these issues are clouded". The facts are NOT clouded. In fact, the issues are not clouded either. Judgements are.

Again, I end with: If you don't like Chinese money buying up real estate (like Japanese money in the 80's, and Arab money all along,) don't buy crap made in China. Or Arab oil, etc..

Otherwise we'll have a new version of that 80's punchline: "I visited Japanese territory the other day. Really, where did ya go? Rockefeller Center."


Posted by isez, a resident of Palo Alto High School
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:44 pm

isez is a registered user.

We all bitch and moan about immigrants. But if we were the immigrants, wouldn't we want to live here too? It's Paradise here, a superior quality of life. Just look at the populations:

U.S. 313,914,040

China 1,344,130,000

India 1,241,491,960

I sure wish they would make English the national language, however. We need to have some sort of connection amongst us all. Why do they have Spanish on package products instead of other languages? If people choose to live here, they should be fluent in English. If I moved to a different country, I would learn their language.


Posted by Reader, a resident of Palo Verde
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:49 pm

Don't believe me about the infiltration of Sharia law in Britain, here is one article Web Link
Don't believe me about how Muslims can change the customs to suit themselves here, here is another article Web Link

This came from just 2 minutes of googling on the subject. Google around further if you want more examples.

Getting the local Y to have Muslim women's hours only may seem like a far cry from stoning a woman for adultery, but how do you think the power of Sharia law starts?

These things start innocently and by the time anyone takes any notice, things have gone so far that it is hard to stop them. Be aware and be watchful.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:53 pm

"Why do they have Spanish on package products.. If I moved to a different country, I would learn their language."

But while you did, you might appreciate and be more inclined to buy products that gave you information you could understand. Buy baking soda instead of baking powder and you have a mess. How long would it take you to get to that level of understanding?

The power of the free market has determined that multilingual packaging is correct.

I obviously don't have a big thing with languages. The Irish adapted. The Germans. The Jews. The Poles. And on and on. I love sitting and having coffee on any busy street/boulevard in the area and trying to identify the myriad of languages.

I guess maybe we didn't adapt that well, after I think about it, as I sit here and type in an immigrants language.

English.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 1:59 pm

@Reader: CBN? Really? No bias there!

Again, I ask: "show me the top ten Sharia laws implemented in Britain."

There are no Sharia law on the British books.

You are talking about ARBITRATION that both parties agree to. From your silly CBN article link; " the courts are legal under a 1996 Arbitration Act that allows people to settle differences through methods of their own choosing."

So silly. Stop living in falsely created fear. Again, I ask: "show me the top ten Sharia laws implemented in Britain."


Posted by Reader, a resident of Palo Verde
on Feb 8, 2013 at 2:40 pm

Values

I can't specifically answer your question but I don't particularly see that as a relevant question anyone.

Instead, I read intelligently and am concerned by what I see.

Here is a recent case from the BBC website. Unfortunately, the British press are not allowed to mention the religion of those arrested for political correctness reasons. Is that freedom of the press or freedom of religion? You can decide that for yourself. You may not think the religion of the men charged is relevant. That is for yourself to decide. But here is a case that made the headlines recently. Web Link

Can you tell me that this would never happen here? Can you tell me that Sharia law was not involved? Can you tell me that this is nothing to do with the power and strength of Islam in Britain?

Can you also tell me that having a "bad attitude" is good reason for what happened to the 12 year old girl in this case.

I don't want to argue details here, that is not why I am highlighting it. I am just pointing out that what starts small can escalate over time. If you want a starting point for googling, google Londonistan and start from there. I will start you off with a link to Wiki Web Link)

This is real. You may not like CBN reporting, but I can't find much in the British press because Muslim reporting is not pc and American press don't generally find any interest in British internal affairs.


Posted by Reader, a resident of Palo Verde
on Feb 8, 2013 at 2:49 pm

Here is another BBC article which again although it doesn't answer your specific question, certainly shows there is recognised Sharia law in Britain. It may not affect any laws on the books, but it shows there are movements and undercurrants. Web Link


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 2:53 pm

At least you freely admit you cannot "show me the top ten Sharia laws implemented in Britain."

BECAUSE THERE AREN'T ANY.

"the British press are not allowed to mention the religion of those arrested for political correctness reasons."

Really? Is that a fact? Then prove it. I offer the BBC website as evidence against your silly statement. Here's the BBC page on Ramadan Web Link

CBN is Pat Robertson's Christian Broadcasting Network. If that's your main source of Sharia OMIGAWD WE MUST LIVE IN FEAR news, then we haven't much to discuss.

"Can you tell me that this would never happen here?" I can tell you the likelihood is similar to creationists thinking man rode dinosaurs 7,000 years ago. It didn't happen, and Sharia won't happen here and more than Hindu or Buddhist law will take over the US. It's so stupid to think about, it actually hurts. Please stop. Stop watching FOX and CBN as your sole news source.

Back to topic, if you are worried about foreign takeover of PA, then quit buying foreign made goods.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 2:59 pm

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


Posted by Anon., a resident of Crescent Park
on Feb 8, 2013 at 3:06 pm

Values .... I said I was not going to debate this issue here since it is off-topic - way so, but also I will not engage with someone who immediately uses terms like "freakazoids" and them starts posting multiple comments. That's really counter-productive and aggressive - like yelling over someone, it kills debate. I am really sorry to see you and others running this off like this, but that's the way internet discussions often go, which is why I am not going to continue.


Posted by Reader, a resident of Palo Verde
on Feb 8, 2013 at 4:23 pm

The British press can freely discuss religion. I am not sure if they can freely discuss the religion of anyone accused of a crime. That would not be pc.Is it pc to know the religion of any particular criminal anywhere?

I am not sure if there is anyway we can truly find the number of crimes committed in Britain by Muslims, or anyone else of any other religion come to that.

I have no means of saying that Sharia law is responsible for any crime in Britain. But, do you have any way of saying that it is not?
I have no way of saying that any laws have been changed to suit Muslim culture, but anecdotally there are many instances where local practices are indeed influenced by Muslim culture. For example, swimming pools in certain areas have "women only" times where no male lifeguards or even pool staff are allowed on the premises. Many state schools allow girls to do PE fully clothed from neck to ankle and any activity where a boy may accidentally touch a girl is strictly forbidden. Many local educational authorities are refusing to teach anything about the Crusades and other historical facts because it is anti Islam. When certain groups in state schools are using their own textbooks with their own slant on history, that becomes worrisome.

You seem to be very upset with what I am saying and that is your right. You appear to be very against Fox and CBN and that is your right. I am not sure where you choose to get your news, but if you think that any news agency is completely unbiased then I ask you to wake up. All news agencies get their funding from somewhere. They depend on their advertisers and if the advertisers don't like what is being reported they can choose to remove their advertising or sponsorship. There is very little freedom for most media.

I am not asking you to do anything but open your eyes and read a little below the headlines. Dig deeper and look for motivation. Sometimes what you are not being told is just as interesting as what you are being told.


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 8, 2013 at 5:23 pm

@Reader "Dig deeper and look for motivation. "

I have, and neither of you can dig deep enough to prove you claims about Sharia law in Britain. And your media comments are silly -- I listened to the C radio station 1100am on the way home half an hour ago, they were talking about the pastor in Iran, using the issue to raise money with an 866 number. Disgraceful they get tax exempt status.

[Portion removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


Posted by A, a resident of Duveneck/St. Francis
on Feb 9, 2013 at 6:44 am

The only thing I fear is the the Palo Alto Online becomes a censor and stops free speech in Palo Alto.


Posted by isez, a resident of Palo Alto High School
on Feb 9, 2013 at 1:27 pm

isez is a registered user.

@ values: Exactly, there is no federal mandate that English is the official language. By placing Spanish on products, America is enabling and Spanish speaking immigrants won't be forced to learn English. With different cultures starting their own strip malls with no English in sight, it effectively excludes non-immigrants, which leads to resentment and conflict. If we can't learn about other cultures, how can we learn to tolerate them? How can we all get along?


Posted by values, a resident of Fairmeadow
on Feb 9, 2013 at 1:53 pm

[Post removed by Palo Alto Online staff.]


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